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[frelling_tralk]

James Marsters Will Be "Team Spike" For All Of Eternity

Every now and then there is a pop culture moment so huge, it forces a semi-dormant fan base to roar back to life. The Buffyverse recently experienced one of these massive in-community controversies when former Buffy star Sarah Michelle Gellar was asked during a Reddit AMA if she was Team Angel or Team Spike.

Had the internet been as omnipresent when Buffy the Vampire Slayer originally aired (from 1997–2003), this question would have been asked and answered a zillion times over, so fans of Joss Whedon’s seminal series were glued to their computer screens as Gellar typed, in all caps, “ANGEL.”

Angel, played with a brooding intensity by David Boreanaz, was Buffy’s first love, but subsequent seasons paired The Slayer — somewhat controversially — with James Marsters’ Spike, an unapologetically bloodthirsty vampire whose redemption became a driving force in the show’s final years. The fandom had long been split over who was truly worthy of Buffy’s heart, but with five letters, Gellar let us all know where she stood.

“Well, I have to say, I really messed with her a lot, so perhaps there’s more to her choice than just what happened on the show,” Marsters told BuzzFeed during a recent interview. “I grew up as a subversive artist, and you have to be so polite to the lead on a film all the time — whether they’re nice or not — so something about that stuck in my craw and I would, sometimes, lovingly mess with her. It’s mean, but I couldn’t help myself. So, maybe I understand why she said that.”


Is it just me, or is that kind of a strange quote? I've never heard James talking of messing with Sarah and upsetting her before, if anything in the past he used to talk about Sarah being the one to tug on his "sock" during their season 6 scenes and how much that would embarrass him, so it sounds like they were both messing with one another at the very least.

Plus I'm not sure why he would assume that some apparent on-set tension between him and Sarah would be the reason for her preferring the Buffy/Angel pairing, she's always been a fan of the Buffy/Angel storyline from the beginning and made no secret of it (I remember interviews in season 4 where Sarah mentioned having a hard time with Buffy sleeping with Parker or moving on to Riley because she kept thinking about how they're not Angel).

I don't know if I'm reading into it, but I get the feeling with "maybe I understand why she said that" that James wasn't too happy with Sarah being so vocal over preferring Angel?




ETA And wasn't sure what to think of the new LJ layout at first, but I was prepared to give it a try. Then I saw how my profile page looks now and I didn't really like it, so I've changed back. Change is hard lol

Comments

[infinitewhale.livejournal.com]

Especially since he's been more or less Bangel himself.

Strange quote indeed. I don't know. Sounds like he just chucked up something to say.

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

Yep, I remember he used to get really emotional at conventions about no one should be rooting for Spuffy as a pairing after season 6, so it seems a little odd for him to be overthinking Sarah's answer that much. But then again I remember that some of the fans were wondering if she had something against James, which never made sense to me at the time as I just assumed that her reasoning was that the Buffy/Angel storyline was simply more to her taste, but maybe James was browsing online and read some of that speculation?

[infinitewhale.livejournal.com]

Sounds like it's something he saw as personal. Going by the quote anyway. Doesn't really wash, though. He'd been a regular 2 years before S6 and a big part on S2. IIRC, Gellar fought to get him in the credits. She couldn't have been that annoyed with him and his 'subversive artist'-ness who doesn't like being nice to leads.

Meh. It's James though. Says weird stuff.

[stolenglimpse.livejournal.com]

I'm a bangel girl for season 1 and 2. Season 3 just didn't do it for me. I loved the banter between Buffy and Spike in season 4 and 5 and then season 6, I do have mixed feeling because I wanted them together and I got them even though it was for the wrong reasons and then he tried to force himself on her and I didn't like him as much but then season 7 and I really love them there even though they aren't together in any real way there. You can see their connection though, especially towards the end.

I'm not sure I understand James here though. He is really talking about the Buffy/Spike relationship and his relationship with Sarah during the show and that would be the reasoning she chose Angel in her answer? It is a bit strange.



I gave lj's new look about 2 minutes and then I switched back. Change is supposedly good but not in this case...

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

I'm a bangel girl for season 1 and 2. Season 3 just didn't do it for me.

I wasn't really into them in season 1 because everything about Buffy falling for Angel felt so rushed and tell instead of show, it seemed like one episode she was swooning over Owen, the next she was sharing these intense moments with Angel when she found out about him being a vampire. I generally prefer the long build-up for my ships and making me wait for them for a bit, but I did enjoy some their scenes in season 2. Or maybe that was just the Angelus arc that I loved :P

And yeah I don't know either, I mean I don't want to read into things too much, but it almost came across to me like he was trying to drop hints about giving Sarah a hard time because as lead of the show she wasn't always pleasant to work with, but at the same time as wanting to say that he knew that he couldn't actually say it, so it came out as what he did want to say sounding rather random and confusing. He never implied anything in the past about doing anything to Sarah that she might have taken offense too, so it just seems odd for him to now suggest that personal problems with him could be part of the reason why she prefers the Buffy/Angel story.

I just don't see why there has to be anything personal to it I guess. Sarah has always been forthright about not loving season 6 and all of the sex scenes, I know that she had a particular problem with the public sex scene in Dead Things and feeling that it was out of character. I actually got the feeling that she might have been up for a fun banter type relationship between Spuffy (I don't know if the rumours were true about Sarah once suggesting a Spike/Buffy ship around season 4 time?), but that season 6 really soured her on them as a couple. She would have never chosen Spike over Angel even if she and James were the best of pals, I always thought that Buffy fans knew that already lol, but apparently not judging by how fandom too responded to her answer :shrugs:


And I didn't mind the changes to the homepage and was prepared to give it a try, but when I saw my new profile page I didn't like it at all, so that was that I'm afraid :P

[infinitewhale.livejournal.com]

(I don't know if the rumours were true about Sarah once suggesting a Spike/Buffy ship around season 4 time?)

She did, but it might have been a joke. I agree the impression she always gave was she was open to it and might have liked it if not for the storyline that played out.

I always thought that Buffy fans knew that already lol,

I think older fans did. There seems to be a pretty big divide between the newer fans and we dinosaurs. Understandable, I guess. A lot of those discussions, interviews, rantings, etc. are gone from the internet, which I didn't think was possible.

[stolenglimpse.livejournal.com]

I wasn't as into them in season 1 for obvious reason. I do feel like it was kinda pushed, like they couldn't have just let alone a love interest for the main character. They danced around each other and then she went out with Owen and then after that it's all about Angel all of a sudden after her being all, he's weird and I didn't like him and I thought he was your friend when speaking to Giles.

Season 2 obviously built into it a lot and I grew to love them. And then they had sex and Angelus came and that was awesome. I love how Angelus was so obsessed with her. So intent on wanting her gone but making her pay.

Sometimes I wonder if I was truly a Bangel fan or if second part of season 2 just made me love them so much because of Angelus. I mean, season 3, they were all lovey-dovey yet oh no we can't be togehter and this because of what could have (had happened) and they were a bore to me. To me, that shipped sailed when Buffy put that sword through him. They had their moments in season 3 and I still think IWRY in Angel is completely awesome but... yeah...

I understand Sarah's view of season 6 and the sex scenes with Spike. Buffy wasn't completely all there through most of it. She sang it in OMWF, she just wants to feel. Spike made her feel with all this "you've come back wrong" speech and then she sexed him up and she felt again. And she came back. She went back to him cuz she felt lost and didn't feel right. Even that public sex scene, she felt lost and out of place and Spike was there and again, he makes her feel. Wrong feelings but she was feeling some things.

Season 7 is basically what sealed me for Spuffy. I mean, I loved all the dancing around each other since Spike first got to Sunnydale and then season 5 happened and he had feelings for her and he was loyal to her. Season 6, well, who wouldn't want to be taken advantage of like that from the person you love? Okay, that sounds kinda bad but even Spike told Buffy he didn't complain lol I was shipping Spuffy because of the chemistry when all he wanted was to hurt and kill her. Season 7, that chemistry was still there with soul as a bonus. They had a connection and not just because of season 6.

Anyway, I'm babbling, aren't I?

If there was tension on set, I believe there was at times because I heard/read rumors. Allison mentioning Sarah was difficult, Sarah mentioning the same for Allison... varied ones so I don't know. What James said here is completely out of the blue, for me anyway. Usually, actors don't rally like talking about bad things happening on sets. Anyway, it's just weird that so long after the show's done, he would say something like that because of one answer, one word, she said for a question that had nothing to do with behind the scenes stuff or more about POV. Guess we'll never truly know because you can bet nobody's gonna go to Sarah to tell her what James said and see what her reaction will be... And she won't come upfront about it either.

As for my POV, hadn't it been for the curse and Angelus being ensoulled again, he never would have loved Buffy. Maybe if Buffy and Liam had lived in the same era but even then, I don't know. Spike went out of his way to get worthy of her. After a bad act on his part but still. He started truly loving her, while still being soulless. Having his soul kind of confirmed he would have still loved her but he was seeing the errors in his ways... in their ways, from season 6... That's another topic entirely *laughs*

[velvetwhip.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure what to make of any of this. Oh well.

As for LJ - tried the new look, hated the functionality, and went right back to the old - better - layout.


Gabrielle

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

It seems strange doesn't it? I never got the sense that there was any bad feeling there in the past, given how much James gushed about how Sarah was an absolute dream to work with, so it's a bit startling to suddenly hear that Sarah and him may have possibly had difficulties on set. I mean presumably that's what James is saying anyway if he believes that bad feeling could still be lingering from his messing with Sarah so much, I'm not sure what to make of what he's saying at the moment


And I didn't really try the new design out that much because I usually use my own page design anyway, still from what I saw of the homepage I didn't love or loathe it and was prepared to give it a try, but then my profile page just looked too different and meh I didn't like that at all, I switched back right after seeing that

[red-satin-doll.livejournal.com]

As for LJ - tried the new look, hated the functionality, and went right back to the old - better - layout.

So far I haven't minded it - I like the cleaner visual layout when I do a new post, but I don't like how the friends page looks so - this is my butt, this is my butt on the fence.

(And your icon is KILLING me btw.)

[lisal825.livejournal.com]

I was neutral on who Buffy ended up with, but needed to see Dru and Spike OTP 5evaaaa ♥

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

I LOVED Spike and Dru!! I never understood why so many fans turned against them in season 5 :( It seemed like everyone just wanted Spike to move past Dru once the arc of him falling for Buffy began, but I still had a lot of fondness for them, I would have loved if they could have brought Dru back in season 7 to see Spike with a soul

[red-satin-doll.livejournal.com]

I would have loved if they could have brought Dru back in season 7 to see Spike with a soul

Dru deserved a lot better than she got - in canon as well as in fandom. She never gets a "complete" arc, she suffers and is tortured terribly, driven insane; and then has to suffer the indignity of a 'devoted lover" who is in love with someone else. I know that's sort of a retcon for FFL (but not much of a stretch), but I've been on both sides of that particular coin and I have a lot of sympathy for her. Emotional abandonment by a lover is still abandonment, even if they are sitting right next to you.

[poniesandphotos.livejournal.com]

Some comments that I've read from Joss makes me think that SMG was a bit of a drama queen. This seems to be in line with that. Although I've also read that she got along well with both David and James I feel like she really wanted Buffy to be seen as a 'good girl' which is more the Angel story line than the Spike one.

in any case. Spike! <3

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

I feel like she really wanted Buffy to be seen as a 'good girl' which is more the Angel story line than the Spike one.

From interviews with Sarah I definitely get the feeling that she wasn't happy with the UPN years, in the Dead Things dailes as well she's complaining about there being too much sex on this freaking show (and James laughs and agrees with her lol). She seemed very proud of young girls watching the show and seeing Buffy as a role model, and things did become a lot messier for her character after season 5

[ever-neutral.livejournal.com]

This mess.

popcorn.gif

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

[red-satin-doll.livejournal.com]

So basically what this comes down to is "me me me it's all about me" and "Sarah is a bitch".
Rather than being about whatever reasons Sarah has for preferring Bangel as a ship to Spuffy. The woman at the center is irrelevant and that's kind of gross. Never mind what infinitewhale already pointed out (as has Spuffylover in conversations) that James didn't ship Spuffy either; and never mind all the interviews in which he talked about how great she was to work with.

BORED NOW.

BTW I recently found some really lengthy High quality outtakes from S6 especially Smashed, Dead Things, AYW, and everything I've seen indicates that whatever their personal feelings, they both joked and laughed a lot but they also worked together very well as actors; throwing each other lines when the other forgets (and James is the one to forget his lines more often than she in the outtakes that I've seen.)

Of course there was tension. Any workplace has tension. Why should a television show be any different?

Bottom line, Sarah has the same right as you or I do - that is she can ship Buffy with whomever the hell she wants, and not have to be raked over the coals for it.

[sum1-different.livejournal.com]

["So basically what this comes down to is "me me me it's all about me" and "Sarah is a bitch".
Rather than being about whatever reasons Sarah has for preferring Bangel as a ship to Spuffy. The woman at the center is irrelevant and that's kind of gross."]

I think Marsters is taking it as personal rejection. He always was a bit odd. But he and Gellar clicked better onscreen than her and Boreanaz.

[kikimay]

Personally I'm totally fine with Sarah being a Bangel. I hate the fact that some Bangels are currently using this information to imply that their ship is better, that it's a proof of something and all that jazz. (Yes, it's happening and it's kinda embarassing)

What bothers me it's how some parts of the fandom are using this stuff.

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

never mind all the interviews in which he talked about how great she was to work with

That's what confused me because James wasn't just throwing out "oh she's really professional" soundbites, in the past he was positively gushing over Sarah being an "absolute dream" to work with and how crazy he was about her, so this supposed tension between them is all news to me

I have most of the season 6 dailies as well and agreed, it was nice to see how well Sarah worked with the rest of the cast and joked around with them. I remember with the DPM dailies it really stood out to me that Nicholas Brendan was forgetting his lines A LOT, but Sarah was very patient and quietly feeding him his lines, rather than snapping at him to get it together the way that you would expect if the diva rumours were true

[sum1-different.livejournal.com]

Gellar's view is disappointing but it's old news and I think Marsters is taking it too personally. He always was a bit odd.

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

Yeah she was always very vocal about loving the Bangel relationship, so I'm surprised that James seemed rather caught unaware that she would pick Angel over Spike

[apeygirl.livejournal.com]

There might be some "whisper down the lane" involved here -- as in he heard what she said wrong or didn't hear it in context. So whatever he heard may have made him take it personally when SMG didn't mean it as a slight against him... or maybe she did. IDK.

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

Hmm that's true, the interviewer might have mentioned it something like "so what do you think about Sarah choosing Angel as the better vampire" in a way that was meant to stir up a bit of drama for James hearing it out of context like that