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Okay so I shouldn't be copying and pasting posts from TWoP just to mock them. That's very wrong of me. But....Someone just posted (and they were serious) in the Spike thread
To take it a step further, not only do I think that Spike sabotaged Riley and Buffy with all the 'holding her but not having her' crap, he also actively sabotaged Angel and Buffy, with his 'you'll never be friends' speech where he explains to them that they can't have a grown-up relationship, that it's gotta be all blood and screaming and heaving bosums, 'cause he himself is incapable of understanding the concept of an adult relationship that isn't about immediate gratification.
Joyce came and talked to Angel later in that season, and Angel confirmed that he'd already come to the same conclusion, that he couldn't be around Buffy any longer, which suggests that it was *Spike* who first planted that coffin-nail.
And this was well before Spike had any interest in Buffy, other than as another Slayer notch on his belt. He didn't want to *have* her, he justed wanted to wreck what was hers. I have no problem seeing him as the one who wrecked the Scoobs dynamic, since there wasn't a relationship of Buffy's that he didn't manage to screw up to some degree. He even messed up her relationship with Dawn, leading to fights between them when Dawn was sneaking out to be with him, and leading to Buffy's neglect of Dawn when Buffy was sneaking out to be with him...
Ultimately, he wrecks everything he touches.
Wtf? Now I don't have a problem with the sensible discussion of Spike's character not working for people. But Spike ruining every relationship in the show??? B/A and B/R breaking up because of Spike?
It's bizarre to go from that to the SV spoiler thread, on the same board, where people are discussing how the season fell apart when Fine left.
To take it a step further, not only do I think that Spike sabotaged Riley and Buffy with all the 'holding her but not having her' crap, he also actively sabotaged Angel and Buffy, with his 'you'll never be friends' speech where he explains to them that they can't have a grown-up relationship, that it's gotta be all blood and screaming and heaving bosums, 'cause he himself is incapable of understanding the concept of an adult relationship that isn't about immediate gratification.
Joyce came and talked to Angel later in that season, and Angel confirmed that he'd already come to the same conclusion, that he couldn't be around Buffy any longer, which suggests that it was *Spike* who first planted that coffin-nail.
And this was well before Spike had any interest in Buffy, other than as another Slayer notch on his belt. He didn't want to *have* her, he justed wanted to wreck what was hers. I have no problem seeing him as the one who wrecked the Scoobs dynamic, since there wasn't a relationship of Buffy's that he didn't manage to screw up to some degree. He even messed up her relationship with Dawn, leading to fights between them when Dawn was sneaking out to be with him, and leading to Buffy's neglect of Dawn when Buffy was sneaking out to be with him...
Ultimately, he wrecks everything he touches.
Wtf? Now I don't have a problem with the sensible discussion of Spike's character not working for people. But Spike ruining every relationship in the show??? B/A and B/R breaking up because of Spike?
It's bizarre to go from that to the SV spoiler thread, on the same board, where people are discussing how the season fell apart when Fine left.
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Date: 2006-01-22 05:34 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2006-01-22 05:37 pm (UTC)And yeah in SV spoiler thread that's the latest discussion, because Fine was seen as the first arc that worked, and the show has apparently lost momentum since